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Author: Subject: Will economic reform ever come?
jent
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icon9.gif posted on 9-16-09 at 08:18 PM   «:|:»  Link to post Reply With Quote
Will economic reform ever come?



It's been about a year since the financial explosion. Billions and billions spent, we were promised regulation to prevent this from ever happening. But nothing, no real legislation passed to help anything.

So it begs the point. Why? What do you guys think? Has the whole country been too occupied with health care and the such that we have forgot once again where we came from? Are high power people preventing this sort of reform?

My biggest worry is that we will get so far from it that it will just get swept under the rug. People will lose there interest, no one will get re-elected because of the issue, and thus nothing will be done.

Have you guys had any thoughts about this?


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[*] posted on 9-17-09 at 04:33 PM   «:|:»  Link to post Reply With Quote


Personally I think Jent hit the nail on the head. They are distracting people with the healthcare issue, an issue that they knew people would be up in arms about "government socialism." Now no one is worrying about the economy.


I had a thought about how much money was spent compared to how much was created. This number is different oppose to what one might think. Since banks are allowed to lend out more money that they have, this is called the reserve requirement. Let's say it is at 10 to 1. That means when they printed out 900 billion dollars and gave it to those banks, which most are trying to repay and others used to buy other banks like BOA taking over Merryl Lynch, the banks could then turn around and loan out ten times as much money as they got. So 900 billion dollars was printed but around 9,000,000,000,000 could actually make it into circulation. This is called inflation. This hurts the economy and makes us sink.


But more importantly, because you were all probably all aware of the fore mentioned material, is that the FED will not say exactly who got most of the TARP money. He has said in congressional testimony that some of it went to FOREIGN banks in Europe. This is why everyone should support, and ask their representatives to support, the Audit the Fed bill that is three people away from having 2/3 co sponsorship in the House. We need to find out what happened to this money and soon.


When you hemorrhage anything for long enough eventually the organism will die. Money is the life blood of our society and if we do not stop the bleeding, especially to people who do not need it, then our society will go bankrupt.


On that note, the Senate will have to vote to raise the debt ceiling of the US federal government before Sept 30th or else the US might have to declare chapter 11. China is dumping dollars for gold and silver so there will be no more loans from them. Japan has their own financial situation so i do not believe they will invest. The US is about to have serious liquidity issues, and printing more dollars will not solve this one.


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[*] posted on 9-18-09 at 11:55 AM   «:|:»  Link to post Reply With Quote


If we never left the basic system that used gold for our bottom line, we wouldn't be having this problem.
I hear there are MORE bills already printed before 2000 than there is gold to back it up, yet they kept right on printing.
How immature!
:barf:


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jent
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[*] posted on 9-18-09 at 07:02 PM   «:|:»  Link to post Reply With Quote


our money standard has not been based on gold for a very long time....think of it just like a promise of possibilities. The value comes from the value of the potential.....I could explain it better, but i am a bit tired right now.

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jent d-_-b
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[*] posted on 9-20-09 at 02:24 PM   «:|:»  Link to post Reply With Quote


Our dollar hasn't been backed by a gold standard for decades... but IMO that isn't our real downfall. It is exactly what Jensen started this thread about: REGULATON! Unfortunatley the leading body of our economic system is full of freshwater thinkers. They inherently frame any economic disaster as an isolated incident that was cause by outside circumstances. IMO this is a fatal flaw. They are incapable of recognizing that capitalism is inherently unstable, i.e. the constant rise and fall of "Bubbles". This is not to say that I think that capitalism is bad, but like any system it needs rules to be governed by. Any financial regulators in power, Bernake included, suscribes to the freshwater philosophy. They think that the only role of government in the economy is to step in and clean up the mess after the bubble has burst instead of crafting rules to keep bubbles from forming in the first place. Sorry for the run-on semi-coherent paragraph, at work typing this so...

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[*] posted on 9-21-09 at 06:49 AM   «:|:»  Link to post Reply With Quote


Spank, you make a valid point.
In effect, what you are saying is already in your sig:
"If logic had been involved it wouldn't have happened in the first place"
What a country...

:duh:


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[*] posted on 9-21-09 at 06:11 PM   «:|:»  Link to post Reply With Quote


so spank, I agree with everything you said. But you did not answer the question if you think the reform will ever actually happen? (or maybe you did and I missed it)

cheers,
jent d-_-b
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[*] posted on 9-22-09 at 12:06 PM   «:|:»  Link to post Reply With Quote


Sorry jent, I didnt' actually answer your Q. Unfortunately I dont really think reform that is needed will come to pass. The Reps. will kick and scream to the death against any form of comprehensive market/banking regulation. The Dems. wont/dont have the political will to push something like that through after they try and tackle Healthcare reform.

You can take comfort in the notion that there aren't any other major markets left to see immediately bubble over ;*) Of course inflation is always a big concern because it takes no political will or accountability to let deficits cause rampant inflation.


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[*] posted on 9-23-09 at 03:50 AM   «:|:»  Link to post Reply With Quote


...Meanwhile those of us who have a few issues of disability sit back and have nothing else left to do but watch and wait.
Well, there is ONE other thing we can do: Suffer a little.
The things we do for (and with) our country. Sheesh!

:duh:


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[*] posted on 9-23-09 at 10:11 AM   «:|:»  Link to post Reply With Quote


Thought you all might want to read this. From the NY Times:
Quote:

WASHINGTON — As a senior House Democrat announced an ambitious schedule to complete legislation overhauling the nation’s financial system, the Obama administration on Wednesday abandoned a symbolically significant provision in the face of widespread political and industry opposition. At a hearing before the House Financial Services Committee, Treasury Secretary Timothy F. Geithner announced that the administration had dropped one provision in its plan for a consumer financial protection agency — a requirement for banks and other financial services companies to offer “plain vanilla” products, like 30-year fixed mortgages and low-interest, low-fee credit cards. Mr. Geithner’s decision followed a wave of criticism by Democrats and Republicans, some with close ties to the industry, that the plan was the first step toward a new regulatory regime in which the administration would be handing new powers to government bureaucrats approving and disapproving a wide array of financial products. Republicans in particular had embraced that line of attack and said it is similar to the flaws in the administration’s health care program of giving government too much power. Among those who had said the provision stood no chance of passage was the committee chairman, Representative Barney Frank, a Massachusetts Democrat, who announced on Tuesday evening that it would not be part of the legislation. “There has been a lot of concern that if you invest the government with the ability to decide what’s appropriate here and there, that will lead to less competition and choice,” Mr. Geithner said. “The chairman’s proposals, which I’ve had a chance to quickly read, provides a better balance of choice and protection.” Consumer groups offered a measured response to the changes, expressing some relief that a stand-alone consumer-protection agency had not been scrapped altogether. “I don’t think anything here is intended to weaken or eviscerate this in any way,” said Ed Mierzwinski, consumer program director at the United States Public Interest Research Group. “The agency will still have a primary role of protecting consumers, and it will still have authorities.” Mr. Frank said he intended to draft the legislation with the committee in the coming weeks in the hope of getting it to the floor of the House as early as November. “Media reports that it is dead for the year are inaccurate,” Mr. Frank said. “This will be a very busy schedule.” In the Senate, the chairman of the banking committee, Christopher J. Dodd, Democrat of Connecticut, has also said he intends to introduce comprehensive legislation soon after further consultations with committee members. Hoping to move the legislation along, Mr. Frank disclosed important limits on the administration’s proposal intended to remove the political obstacles that had stalled that plan. Mr. Frank’s version restricts the scope of the proposed agency, but still leaves it significantly more powerful than the banking industry would like. Since the administration proposed the creation of the agency last June, the industry has mounted a major lobbying campaign to kill it. Mr. Frank announced that the legislation he was drafting would exempt a variety of businesses — merchants, retailers and providers of retirement plans, among others — from oversight by the new consumer financial protection agency. The agency was proposed by the administration to protect consumers from deceptive or abusive credit cards, mortgages and other kinds of loans. Mr. Frank said the legislation would provide for a way to resolve disagreements between regulators at the new agency and those at the other agencies that examine banks. The proposal by Mr. Frank was an effort to address the widespread criticism of the new agency by banks, while trying to assure that the new agency has some regulatory teeth. While narrowing the agency’s authority, the Frank plan would give the agency both the authority to write and enforce regulations. Both Mr. Frank and Mr. Geithner emphasized that the legislation would be designed to limit the “too big to fail” policy of bailing out the nation’s largest institutions. That policy, which has provoked widespread voter anger, was central to the bailouts of Bear Stearns and American International Group and led to big loans to the largest banks in the nation. “We will be putting a package of legislation together that will substantially diminish that problem,” Mr. Frank said. “We will be providing for mechanisms for putting financial institutions out of their misery. There will be death panels enacted by this Congress but they will be for large institutions that are seen as too big to die. We are talking here about dissolution, not resolution. We are talking about making it unpleasant for these institutions to die.” Mr. Geithner said those institutions whose problems could shake the financial system will face far greater regulatory scrutiny and higher capital standards. But under questioning from Representative Spencer Bachus of Alabama, the ranking Republican on the committee, he refused to rule out the possibility of future bailouts of big companies. “You can’t have a system, how shall I say it, where you abolish the fire station, or lock the doors to the fire station,” Mr. Geithner said. “That’s not a system that works.”


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[*] posted on 9-23-09 at 01:03 PM   «:|:»  Link to post Reply With Quote


holly line breaks batman!! :duh:

cheers,
jent d-_-b
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[*] posted on 9-23-09 at 02:12 PM   «:|:»  Link to post Reply With Quote


Ya, when I put it in the quotes box it removed the paragraph spacing... sorry.

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[*] posted on 9-27-09 at 11:54 AM   «:|:»  Link to post Reply With Quote


Im not sure if anyone feels like reading more about this but I figured I would share so that someone can if they want. HERE is a piece from Bloomberg that is quite short but at the end is a link to a pdf of the proposed legislation. If you only feel like reading the pdf HERE is the link.

Hope someone finds this beneficial. Im really hoping that the consumer advocacy gets up and running along w/ the gov. getting the ability to dismantle failed financial institutions. There is way too much systemic risk for these businessess to not be properly regulated, IMO.


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[*] posted on 9-27-09 at 06:56 PM   «:|:»  Link to post Reply With Quote


regulation may come, but unfortunately I don't think dismantling failed institutions will ever happen

cheers,
jent d-_-b
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